Caroline Slee-Poulos and Ron talk about the progression of Classroom and Webinar training to the Internet Based Training we offer today.

I wanted to try and use this as a... communications device to everybody as to how we have evolved the learning products from the initial days in the consulting world, the 80s and 90s, to the Quest Learning Center classroom and webinar world, to now the Learning Without Scars internet-based world. And over the last 18 months, you've been teaching virtually. You have not been in a classroom since, what, January of 2020?

Actually, Friday the 13th of March 2020. That was my last day face-to-face with students in the classroom. And this Thursday will be my first day face-to-face with students since then.

Which is the 12th.

Yes.

Rather interesting. And how, so you taught basically a full school day over, what was it, Zoom or Teams or what device? We

use Zoom. Although we did try Google Meet, we tried Microsoft Teams. Zoom was the tool that seemed to work best in terms of bandwidth and accessibility. I teach in a very rural school district. So infrastructure is oftentimes an issue. So the bandwidth issue was a very real thing for us to contend with as the school year started, trying to figure out how do we do this so that it's not as glitchy, so to speak, or how do we do this so that everybody has the material available and they can replay it later if they need to. And overall, it went very well.

What changes did you make in your teaching styles, methods? Moving from the classroom to the Zoom meeting, is there anything that really stood out or that you could point to as either a benefit or a shortfall?

I had a very hard time adjusting to being in one place. When I'm in the classroom live with students, I'm never at my desk. I'm never sitting down in one spot. engaging, interacting, walking around. The students are largely learning in teams, in groups, together, cooperatively, and then putting together their own projects individually. But teamwork is a huge part of how they learn. They're social, and they're supposed to learn how to socialize more effectively as well. So for me, the sitting in one spot was tough. One of the benefits is that I felt the transitions, which are usually so difficult in a face-to-face classroom, we're finishing one thing and moving into the next. And that can be messy in a classroom. On Zoom, those transitions really are easily controlled with, for example, okay, you're breaking into teams now. You see your breakout rooms are open and go. And they get ported over to a new little breakout room and I can hop around and do what I do to check in with them. I close the breakout rooms. Everybody's automatically transitioned back to where they needed to be. So in terms of what I think of as lost time, that went away. We had the transition time that normally is a little muddled, especially at the beginning of the year. it was reduced to almost nothing because of the technology aspect. So that was actually a pretty neat way of doing it. We also increased our time per class because we were doing it virtually. And in that way, I was able to give students homework, so to speak. But it was something we were doing during the Zoom meeting, which as an English teacher is a big deal. If there's a question, on an assignment, it's better to be able to ask it right there live with other students or your teacher available to help you. So the timeframes were very nice on Zoom meetings. It's hard though not to have the interaction and the ability to read body language. Some students, you can tell they're confused by how they hunch their shoulders. You don't see that on Zoom too well.

Yeah, what you're describing is kind of the way that I used to set up classrooms with round tables, four to six people a table, six to eight people or six to eight tables in a room. And like you, I wandered around, but I didn't have the time lost in breakout rooms because everybody was in a breakout table. The only place that that would have been a problem for me is if I wanted different people. different tables through. And I came to the conclusion at the beginning was that it was easier for me not to have everybody moving all over the darn place through the course of the class. And what we would do is we'd have a, quote, lecture material being presented to them with slides and me talking films with everybody watching 15 to 25 minute films, occasionally some of the case studies from Harvard were 40,45 minutes. And then we would have a breakout exercise relative to that particular subject. And it sounds other than the wandering around, which you and I do almost genetically, which my mother did when she was teaching and my grandmother did when she was teaching, sitting in one spot is tough. I used to enjoy the film because it would give me a chance to reorganize my thinking as I went through the day to do eight hours or nine hours nonstop, even though there's a lunch in the middle of it and be able to keep your senses about you is rather difficult.

It can be difficult. Part of the reason I incorporate movement for students is that I've discovered, well, first of all, I teach teenagers. Not quite as able to stay at their group in one seat all day long, considering I can't vouch for what happens in other classrooms. I know that there are quite a few lecture formats that go on and they have to stay still. I've noticed that an opportunity to get up, move around, switch something over, all of a sudden they're fresher. They can do more. It sort of holds off that little, okay, I'm fried now. I've burned out during the day. But yes, I agree. The wandering through the classroom is genetic.

Yeah. The other thing that happens, like you talked about teenagers, the other thing that happens with adults, and I'm noticing it more with the internet-based because we've got better statistical information. that people coming into the classroom, some of them have been on that job for 30 or 40 years, and their company sent them to a training class. And who's this idiot at the beginning in the front of the class that's supposed to teach me something about it? He doesn't do that job. So they come in, cock of the walk, thinking they know everything, and we take them to places that they've never been before or contemplating, almost like you're a high schooler and you haven't. had the joy of reading the diary of Anne Frank and all the mystery that goes behind that. But the student that's reading the book is, this is brand new and it's exciting. And I've never been there before versus my guys. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt. What do you got for me? Cynicism, right?

Although that does sound a lot like the first day of the school year with teenagers. Only they don't walk in thinking they know everything. They walk in knowing they know everything and that I'm probably dumb and boring.

Yeah.

So it doesn't stay that way, of course. But it's an interesting transition from youth to adulthood and how often we, not me personally, but we as humans, I think, have this expectation that graduation marks an end point. And now I don't have to go do that school stuff anymore. I don't have to learn or take classes anymore. When in fact, being in the same job position 30 years, as you mentioned, you want the latest methods. You want to hear if there's something new out there. Maybe there's some little trick of the trade that hasn't made its way to you that would make your day better, easier, faster. Take away some of the tedium, you know?

Yeah. And yet it seems to be running counter to that. More so now than at any time I can remember. Companies are hiring people with what they believe are the skills that are necessary for the job. And today marks the first time that there's over 10 million job openings in America. First time ever. And at the same time, companies are having a heck of a hard time finding employees that are job ready to be able to walk into things and do things. So what the company's philosophy seems to be is I'm going to hire you for your skills and talents. But if those skills and talents go away and they don't stay current, I'll replace you with somebody who has current skills and talents rather than pay money to develop you that could then make you more. marketable outside of my company, because that's what I'm bothered by. And then on the other side, exactly what you just said, the employees get out of school, they rub their hands, say, boy, that's good. I'm glad that's over with. And I can't imagine with the world that we live in, looking out the window over the 50 plus years I've been working, the rate of change has never been faster. The nature of it has never been more significant. You know, you've heard me, Tarika, Carolina, the transition from the steam engine to the electric engine being something that was done very quickly, but it took another generation of management leadership to take advantage of the tool. We've only had the cell phone for about 10 years. We've only had the laptop for about 40 years. We've only had a computer for about 70 years. And we really haven't started using any of these things. A screen looks like a piece of paper. That's the way that the dealer business systems have evolved. We just put it on a computer screen, made it faster. We didn't really change anything.

And yet today, your grandson comes running up to me to say, did you know there is now an entire discipline of engineering exclusively devoted to artificial intelligence? I did not know that. It makes sense to me that there would be, so I'm not surprised by it. But apparently this is newer. It's new enough that it's now finally making its way into mainstream conversations that high school juniors are seeing. Did you know you can do a summer camp for this? Because we have a summer camp over here at wherever it may be. And that's, I mean, that's a huge, in my day. I think Stephen King was the one writing about that because the computers were going to take over the world. Now it's something that students can grow into, learn about and move on to. It's a way of taking something that almost every kid enjoys, computers, games, making things like a game and turning it into skill.

Yeah, just look at, you know, education for kids and how it's changed. I want to come back to how we've evolved the classes, but think of the Khan Academy, a guy working in the financial industry in New York City because of his nieces. He created the Khan Academy that now has had millions and millions and millions of people go through classes from pre-K right through high school graduation. It's remarkable.

When I was in sixth grade, I believe it was. My Spanish teacher at the time, Senora Haas, had a hotline for us where we could call a free tutoring line if we were stumped on our Spanish homework. And there would be young people available to help you with your Spanish homework if you were totally stuck on questions or the writing portion, whatever it may be. I even had to call once because... I lost a word. And of course, we didn't have the handy dandy internet to use Google Translate and find the word. I still remember the word. Todo. All. But I had to call the little tutor hotline for students in Spanish classes. But that's now. Could log into Khan Academy, watch a video, do some practices. Or if it's foreign language, go into Duolingo, which lets you friend people. And you can compete with each other to see who's making more progress in the foreign language of choice each day.

It's remarkable. One of the people that I've had the pleasure of meeting is a man by the name of Jim McGrath, who created a software education business when his children were young. He now works for Google and has a couple of doctorates from MIT. Incredibly sharp guy. And he has patents pending on moving the cursor on your screen with his eyeball.

Oh, wow.

Won't need the keyboard at all. Voice recognition being what it is now is everywhere. But as things have changed and starting with you in the virtual classroom from March, Friday, the 13th,2020 to now, let me back up a little bit and talk about. how we evolved in teaching from, first of all, back at McGill when I was a lecturer teaching people how to teach athletics in the water. So swimming and water polo, water ballet, those types of things. So I was teaching them how to teach those things and teaching them how to learn to coach in those areas. And we had a three-hour night, three nights a week. hour and a half in the classroom, hour and a half in the pool. And then as I got into the cat dealer and was plugged into where we had troubles, I had to create communications to people about the things that we were changing because part of my schooling was industrial engineering, which today is kind of called five. Like if I go through the evolution, it's industrial engineering to continuous quality improvement to. Six Sigma to 5S, now it's 7S. And so we changed the term every 10,15 years and just keep on getting a little better at what we're doing. But that was very specific teaching, short lectures with more hands-on, so on-the-job type training. And then as we got into consulting and we started making a more significant impact on operations, I had to start creating teaching elements in the consulting world, which we then transitioned to Quest Learning Centers in the early 1990s. We started with three-day classes, ended up with two because three was too much. It was too hard to maintain a quality learning experience. But with two days, what we did was we had four four-hour blocks of time in two days. One block we did with management, one block we did with operations, one block we did with selling, and one block we did was financials. And within each of those four blocks, we would have two specific subjects. So each two-day session had eight, what today we call subject-specific classes. And I did that over a three-year cycle. First year was called what it looks like when it's right. The second year was called. reaching market potential. And the third year was something about market capture and potential. And we took those 24 classes and put them all online. You did that. So we married my content, slides, audio tracks, film clips. We had all those little pieces, hundreds and hundreds of them. And we said, okay, here, Caroline, we want to put this up on the internet. How do we do that?

Well, the initial conversation before putting it up on the internet was when you were running webinars.

That's true. I forgot that step.

You and mom were spending more time each year in Honolulu, and you had an enormous projector screen that you set up in your apartment. And mom would have to tiptoe carefully around the edges of the apartment to avoid what we refer to as Zoom bombing today, but webinar bombing back then. And that was the first iteration of, is there a way we could do this passively? Because wouldn't it be nice for mom to be able to actually walk across the apartment and you wouldn't have to get up at three in the morning, which would be even more helpful. And we moved from there.

Actually, freeze frame on that for a second, because I'd forgotten that, and that's an important transition. I hated webinars. There's a slide up on a screen that everybody can see, and you're listening to my voice. And as a teacher, I don't see my student. We talked about not being able to be wandering around the room. I couldn't see anybody, and that drove me nuts. And also, I sensed and got the feeling from people that I speak to. They didn't like it much better than I did. So we changed the game. We used an eight foot by eight foot screen, a computer projector, a computer, and I had the capacity to turn on and off the slideshow. So we do kind of what we're doing now, but we have me go for 10 or 15 slides. And then I turn off the slideshow and walk in front of the camera. Now you're looking at me and it started to become. a little bit more interactive. And then we'd go back to some more slides and we'd come back. And I started wearing Hawaiian shirts. And people came to the classes to find out what shirt I was wearing. And they were very quick because in the webinars, when I was talking, I opened it up so that everybody could talk at the same time. I couldn't see them all. This wasn't Zoom or Skype. This is in the 90s and aughts. I could hear them and they'd make comments about my shirt. It was either too boring or whatever because they liked the flashy stuff. But that also was something that, yes, that's what triggered it.

2011 and 2012, I would open the waiting room for the go to meeting webinars and people would say, do you have the scoop on the shirt for the day?

It was funny. And then if I wore the same shirt. To the same group of people for the, for another one, they got hostile. What's the matter with you? Haven't you got another shirt? And those shirts are expensive, darn it. And I'm cheap.

But it was over on our side, just with mom having to tiptoe around. That was, Joe made the comment first. Isn't there a way to do this where he doesn't have to get up in the dark? Your mom can just, you know, do whatever. And I said, I don't know. And the I don't know is always a good place to start for us. And we found software within a year or so. And it was limited back then. The products that were available to put your own classes online for student-led and student-paced learning

weren't

as broad. or wide of a selection as they are today. So we started with a product called Lectora, which was, for me, for my learning curve, it was clunky because it needed me to have a little bit more back-end knowledge of web design than I had at that time. Today, it would actually be manageable because, you know, over time I learn and I would take all the classes. But we started putting classes together on there. But as with all good things, you know, the learning management software as it changes and evolves and fixes what it's doing for its own systems and processes, it also changes the packaging that's available. So we were stuck in that strange position of being a little too small for what they were offering. But knowing we would almost be there within a few years, so we switched over to Litmos, which was a much easier interface. But then it was a matter of now we have all these slides, we have all this material. How do we really break down that original classroom and those webinars from the classroom into something manageable that will bring the students in? give them the information they need, but not make a career out of the training for them. And part of how we have slowly worked development of the classes out is because of our students, our student feedback, the surveys we have at the end of each class. So our initial format, which is slowly being phased out, was to take your text, your industry knowledge, your experience in operations, in parts, in service, in product support, in segmenting a market so that you know how to manage customers and meet their needs and keep them happy so they stay. Taking all of that, which was text, turning it into slides, getting audio laid into the slides, and then saying, well, wait a minute. How do the students know what they're getting out of this? Let's build a little quiz to start the class so they can see where they are before they learn anything and then have the final test at the end. Some things that are changing are the test format. We have options now where you can just go in and take a broad assessment in a specific subject, specific job function. or the overarching theme of management of a department. And you can see where you score and have tailor-made recommendations for you based on that before you ever take a class, which is a really efficient way of helping students move into selecting what they need or what they want. Now, sure, a supervisor can tell them you need this, and that's easy for a student. But part of what we do is try to make sure a student can come to the website and say, this is what I do. How do I get better at it? How do I make sure I'm going to get a great performance review? How do I put myself in line for a raise, a promotion, whatever goal it may be that the individual student has?

And let me interrupt there just briefly, because some of the feedback that we were getting, and we've had thousands and thousands of people take. our classes and our assessments. The comment that came back to me is, boy, I wish I'd known what this person was like before I spent money on their training, because I'm not sure I want to keep them as an employee. Can you not give me something, Ron, that'll allow me to evaluate whether this guy is a keeper or not? And I started interacting with them on the basis of, okay, what do you want to use this thing for? And that's where our assessment. job function skills assessment program came from in that we have all the classes and you mentioned the pre-test and the final test. So each class has 30 questions. We have 36 classes in parts. That means we've got 1,080 questions, multiple choice. So what we've done is we've taken in parts, I think it's six job functions, telephone and counter sales, parts office, warehousing, et cetera. In service, I think we've got eight. And in selling and marketing, I think we've got four. So there's 18 job function assessments, each of which has 90 multiple choice questions that have been selected from that 1,080 overall and chosen because of their relevance to that particular job function. And everybody gets a score. Since we've had the new assessments in place, and I think we've clocked a little bit over 3,500 people on them, I've had one person hit 90% on the final assessment. The highest average seems to be 72%. And if we look at educational blocks, how universities and schools segment the results,0% to 50% is developing,50% to 75% is beginning. 75 to 90 is intermediate and 90 and above is advanced. That means most of the people that we are running assessments on are in the beginning level, which is a very sobering statement for a lot of people that have been doing the same job for 10 or 15 or 20 years. And it was one of the things that was thrown in my face very early on in my career. Well, you don't have any experience. You've only been at this job for about a year. And I said, well, how long have you been on the job? 30 years. Has it been the same job? Yeah. Well, all you've got is one year experience, but it's 30 times one year. What's the difference between the two of us? And that was a hard concept for both of us to come to grips with. But that's kind of where our assessments are, isn't it? You can't hide.

True. And it's some feedback from students, not on the management side. because I enjoy reading the surveys, which we added at the end of each class so that students would have an opportunity to say what worked for them, what didn't work for them, what they would like to see in a future class, something that they want to go implement right away based on what they've learned. And one of the consistent themes across surveys is, you know, it's funny. I'm used to what I do. I know my job well. But there's still information that I'd never heard before. And I considered myself experienced. And so I always like the fact that our students still get that, oh, ah, I hadn't thought of that. That's new information for me. What can I do with this? But other things that came about from those surveys were the fact that our original structure, the one being phased out of. the class as a block slides with audio was too long. Now, it's always been set up so that a student can pause, it will save their place, they can walk away, come back to it later. But from what students have said, they feel the pressure to finish it all in that one big block. I pushed play and I'm doing it all now. So we're splitting it into 10 to 12. shorter blocks. And this is where, oh yeah.

Well, no, that's great. Stop with that one though, just for a moment, because this is in line with changes in teaching and education over the last three to five years.

Yes. There's a lot of research to support the fact that our attention span benefits from shorter segments, little changes, pausing, check in, find out. Where are you on this information? Do you understand what you've learned? Show me something that you're getting out of this.

But it also has highlighted something that I found intriguing, that if we don't tell them that there's a quiz in the middle or a quiz after 10 minutes, the answer to that first quiz, the responses are not very good. The second one, it gets better. By that point. They know there's going to be a quiz. So learning then becomes an active sport, not a passive sport where they can check in and out to the person who's talking with them. And, you know, while I didn't go very far, which is why I never used to tell people where I was coming from on a textbook. They always wanted to know what's the next class. I'll tell you when I get here, because I didn't want them reading ahead and being smarter than I was. I wanted them to talk. concentrate on what I was telling them, and then they could reinforce it with the reading. But that break in education every 10 minutes or so, a typical university class is 50 minutes long. And they found that a 10-minute quiz increased learning and retention by as much as 50%.

So they also found it increased the student's ability to analyze how they learn because when they have the frequent check in to see their score, to see what they're retaining, to see their performance, so to speak, they become much more deliberate overall about what we call the meta level, learning about learning. So they start to go, well, wait a minute. I heard that. I saw that. Why did I get it wrong? And they start to really dial in in a different way. So engagement changes.

That's really powerful. So continuing with what you were talking about, we've broken the classes down. It started with a pre-test and a 90-minute roughly slideshow video, and then a 20-minute final assessment. Then we brought in surveys, then certificates. Then we brought in reading lists. Now we're breaking it up. So you could have 150 slides with 10 quizzes. Every 15 slides, there's a quiz. So that means that the video, the film clip that we create for the learning, instead of it being one 90-minute duration, it might be 10-minute durations,10-15-minute durations. Makes reporting a heck of a lot more complicated.

True, but from a student standpoint, it makes a class, a lot more manageable.

Oh yeah. Yeah.

I agree with that. Especially since so many are, it's, it's training for employment. So, so many students try to do this at work. You know what? You might only have 10 minutes. And if you have a segment and you know, you can get it done, that's great. It's something you've shot and checked off your list. You've accomplished something outside of your nine to five, and it's geared towards improving your whole day. And your life, I would argue, because the more you know about what you're doing, the more you increase your expertise, the better you feel about what you're doing.

There's a direct, Harvard did a really comprehensive survey back in the late 80s, early 90s about employee satisfaction and loyalty. And the biggest risk for an employee is not knowing what they're doing on the job and hiding that truth from the world around it. knowing sooner or later they're going to get caught, but they don't get caught very often because they do the job the way they were taught and they just continue to do it day in, day out, which is why work is a four-letter word from my perspective. They don't put any joy in that at all. And, you know, go back to those assessments for a second. We've got people now using the assessment on a hiring routine. So if you want a job at this company, take this assessment. We'll talk about it afterwards. We're having people using the assessments on their annual performance review. And we changed the whole context of the performance review. It's now about what would you like to do as an employee here? What would you think you'd be, what would be more interesting for you? This job or this job or this job, and then we can talk about it. Or we just did this evaluation and here's eight classes that are recommended. because of the 20 or 30 students,1,000 students that have taken this stuff, which of those do you think you'd like to take first? So it now becomes a personalized deal. And the other one that's important to me is it allows us objectively to evaluate how we pay people and that we pay them fairly based on skills rather than opinions. It's a tough case. But then we go to the class and then just to... extend a little bit more of that. Somebody who's done the job 20,30 years, and they've told me this, so I'm not making this up. Well, they go right to the final assessment. I know this stuff. They go right to the assessment. Well, you have to have 80% on the assessment in order to pass it. And they went through quickly, and guess what? They didn't pass it. Oh, darn. Now they go back to the class, and they do what you and I lovingly call skimming and scanning. I know, but I'll go through this thing quickly. And you can go through the film clips, the video of the class quickly. You can skip the audio tracks. You can just read and move to the next. Well,90% of the people that didn't get 80% the first time, they don't get 80% the second time either. 10% get it. Third time, they get it. But where it's really fun is when they don't get it and they're locked out. They have to go back to their boss and say, I wasn't able to get that grade that was required. Can you call and have them open it up so I could take it again? And we never have a problem with the second class. They take the class, they pass the 80% and we move on. But they had to learn that, which is the 10 minute increment thing that the learning, the meta learning changes. And it's powerful. So now we've got 100, we got. 108 classes,36 in parts,36 in service,36 in selling and marketing. And you put all of that into litmus, all of those stages.

Yes, the fancy title for what I do is curriculum designer. But I mostly think of it as occasional hair puller outer because I'm going crazy trying to get something to upload. But yes, the classes all go into litmus. Students can then, so the ultimate goal, the exciting part, Litmos will allow students, and we aren't there yet, but this is my 2022 goal for everybody. Litmos will allow students to compete with each other. So as an example, and it's probably unfortunate that I treat all humans like teenagers in this aspect, little competition's a good thing. You can gamify. the class. Students can be put onto a team. They can see who's getting the highest score. They can see who's moving through the class faster. They can start, they can have a little forum discussion with each other and egg each other on. And it sounds so simple and almost ridiculous, but it takes the whole process and makes it a company-wide event. And they start having fun with each other. If you have a bunch of new hires together who are in the same class and they can actually start, you know, ribbing each other and saying, ha, my pretest was better than yours. Yeah, but did you see my first module test? I got you beat there. And they buy in with each other more because it's not only about, okay, are you worth hiring? Are we giving you a raise? What's your performance evaluation? It can give them a chance to see what each other are made of. So, you know, because we don't like sitting still much, either of us in terms of how we do things or the literal aspect of sitting still, that's the look ahead to the next step. The meanwhile step is that I have been working on our application with IASET for accreditation. With IASET, one of the key components is always having things that are measurable, meaning we don't give things to our students as a goal, as an objective that they cannot demonstrate. Goals are always supposed to be smart goals, right? They're specific, they're measurable, they're accessible, they're repeatable, and they're also things you can teach. With IASED, it's really forced us to fine tune how we do what we do, not just how we load it in, how we build it, but how do we communicate these things in a way that makes it accessible to the employee on the other side who's going, look, I just walked through the door. I graduated high school. A few months ago, I have no idea what's happening. Or the employee who's saying, I've been here 30 years. What do you think you can show me? Making sure that it's all information that can open a door for them and that they can show off at the end of the class.

One of the things that ISED has forced us into is this type of documentation that ISO standards and ANSI standards. have been preaching for years that, you know, you've got it. There's a format. There's a structure. It's good old-fashioned industrial engineering, but it has been a really nice lesson for us, I believe, along the path. That application is, what,350 pages long?

I think so. I mean, some of the, some of it's process work, right? They want to know exactly how you and I do things. And they want every single detail of how we do things. So in some cases, I'm writing six pages to explain something. And it's bullet point style, but it's still six pages. So it can be, yeah, I think the bare minimum is 250 pages, but I think ours is around 360.

Well, the other interesting thing from my perspective is there's nobody else in this industry that has that kind of certification. So we're hopeful that that'll be coming at us soon and that your efforts will all bear fruit. The other thing that's happening, along with all of the segmentation and the continuous evolution and gamifying it next year, I'm excited like heck about that. Another thing that's happening is that we have started offering Zoom meetings. after the class for people who have taken a class. So if I've got six to eight people that take a class, for instance, on work order process, we'll offer them a Zoom meeting with me, or it could be others in the future, where we'll spend an hour or two on the phone talking about the class, answering questions, providing a little bit more context. So that's our current thinking about putting me back in the classroom, except not.

Yes, without the jet lag and the early, early, early arrivals and late departures.

Yeah, the life that is on the treadmill that is very difficult to get off. Last thing, we've got most of our parts classes. Well, let me change that. All of our assessments are available in English, Spanish and French. All of the parts classes are now available in French. We're closing in quickly on having all of the Spanish classes finished, and you'll be able to process the registration and the purchase all online with enroll now buttons. We also have audio tracks explaining each of the classes now on parts and on service so that you can read about it. You can also hear it. So we're trying to make things. more interactive and more current as we go. And this isn't what I'd anticipated for retirement, Caroline.

Well, I honestly anticipated that you would be really bored if you ever retired. And I did float the idea of you joining a group of golfers. And I also floated the idea of you taking some culinary arts classes. But both of those you went, oh, maybe. And I was like, or, you know, just keep going. Just do it this way. Yeah.

So I think as our inauguration or our initial chat in the subject of lessons learned, I think we've covered a lot of ground. We've given them kind of how we evolved into teaching in this industry. We've given them how we evolved from lectura to litmus and how we've changed the classes. how we've restructured things. And it's a constant evolution, isn't it? It's adapting to what the surveys tell us and what our students tell us they want to have. And I'm grateful for all of that. And I think that you've done a wonderful job in putting this together for everybody. And you got any closing comments on that while I'm giving you praise, which I don't know that you're that used to?

Well, I'll say thank you for the praise. And it's exciting to see how far we've come, but it's also exciting looking ahead at where we're going. Because I think what we do really makes a difference. Makes a difference to not just the companies, but the employees at the companies. To anybody who really wants to change their game a little bit.

At that point, that's a wonderful chapter end, I think. Everybody wants to do a good job and everybody wants to feel that they've made a mark somewhere along the way, which to me is doing worthwhile work. And this industry, without it, we don't have electricity, we don't have roads, we don't have water, we don't have a whole bunch of things without the trades that we're looking after. So, Caroline, thank you. And I look forward to the next. chat we have about lessons learned. And to everybody listening to this podcast, mahalo. Thank you. And I look forward to having you listen to another podcast from us in the near future. Thank you for listening to our podcast. We appreciate your support. Should you have any thoughts or comments, please don't hesitate to contact us at www. learningwithoutscars. com. The time is now. Mahalo.